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Two Different 5e Games at the Same Table

by Mike on 3 February 2024

When we sit down to play a 5e game at our table, we're actually playing two different games with two different sets of rules, sometimes from totally different publishers.

Players play one game – with a focus on characters and the rich mechanics surrounding them. GMs play another – with a focus on monsters, treasure, scenes, situations, world building, and more.

These two games mesh together on a shared and agreed-upon baseline of rules. We can change both sides of the game significantly and still play a fun game at our table.

The easiest example of this is when gamemasters use a different monster book than the default monster book for our chosen 5e system (likely D&D but possibly Tales of the Valiant or Level Up Advanced 5e). Switching monster books is common. We can use 5e monsters from lots of different publishers, including building and improvising our own. We can use simple and straight forward stat blocks like those in the Tales of the Valiant Monster Vault or crunchy tactical monsters like those in Flee Mortals. Even with vastly different design philosophies, these monster sources still work.

It's not a huge revelation to note that GMs are playing one type of game at the table and players another. But when we think of it this way, it opens further possibilities to change up and customize our game – getting back the modular feeling that 5e's designers intended in the 2012 to 2014 playtest of D&D Next.

There are many ways we can shake up the game on the GM's side such as

including the journey rules from Uncharted Journeys.
using safe havens and supply from A5e's Trials and Treasure.
using doom points from Tales of the Valiant.
giving out spells from Deep Magic 1 or 2 as special rewards, single-use magic items, or strange powers for monsters.

Likewise, we can talk to our players about changing things on the player-side of the game by

selecting a different core sourcebook for character options such as D&D 2014, D&D 2024, the Tales of the Valiant Player's Guide, or the Level Up Advanced 5e Adventurer's Guide.
offering multiple flavors of 5e on the player's side in the same game! It seems impossible but I'm doing it right now and it works just fine.
replacing inspiration with ToV's "luck" system.
allowing character options from books like Kobold Press's Tome of Heroes.

It's trickier to mess with the game on the player's side because changes we make there affect everyone and are permanent unless we pull them back. On the GM side, we can change things all the time. If we don't like how our change worked, we can throw it out and never use it again.

Thinking Differently About the Game We Play

Thinking of our game as a series of components – with a separate game being played on the player side and GM side – gives us lots of interesting ways to tweak and change things to fit the style of game we enjoy.

More Sly Flourish Stuff

Each week I record an episode of the Lazy RPG Talk Show (also available as a podcast) in which I talk about all things in tabletop RPGs.

Last Week's Lazy RPG Talk Show Topics

Here are last week's topics with time stamped links to the YouTube video.

Talk Show Links

Here are links to the sites I referenced during the talk show.

Patreon Questions and Answers

Also on the Talk Show, I answer questions from Sly Flourish Patrons. Here are last week's questions and answers.

Can I Submit Your Book to Adobe's AI Tool?

Last week I also posted a YouTube video on Blood Magic – Dragon Empire Prep Session 10.

RPG Tips

Each week I think about what I learned in my last RPG session and write them up as RPG tips. Here are this week's tips:

Call on individual characters during online games.
Clarify options and ask for decisions from each player.
Assign a “caller” who gets consensus from the group.
Assign roles to players including scribe (game notes), cartographer (mapping), quartermaster (loot tracking), and caller (choice consensus).
Ensure each scene has choices and options for the characters’ approach.
Have characters describe their new features to the group on leveling up.
Keep narrative descriptions brief and focus quickly on the options in front of the characters.

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